tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post2476315472353990356..comments2024-03-27T06:51:19.327-06:00Comments on The Rains Came Down: Gay Marriage?SilverRainhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comBlogger50125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-6874166796413383492010-08-16T23:05:33.283-06:002010-08-16T23:05:33.283-06:00Silver Rain, Thanks for your efforts here.Silver Rain, Thanks for your efforts here.jinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-38446326414764812462010-08-13T08:17:54.181-06:002010-08-13T08:17:54.181-06:00Marmots: If you're trying to get a rise out of...Marmots: If you're trying to get a rise out of me by trolling, consider it failed.SilverRainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-7726799080355897562010-08-12T14:03:00.806-06:002010-08-12T14:03:00.806-06:00SilverRain, I mean this in all sincerity; are you ...SilverRain, I mean this in all sincerity; are you a lesbian? I'm getting this really strong vibe that you really really really are ambivalent about that whole heterosexual thing, and those of us that like it are just kidding ourselves. We're not, you are. <br /><br /> Maybe you should think about joining a religion that doesn't hate your (presumed) essential nature.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09919483054658632621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-80443979227541763382010-08-12T13:57:51.816-06:002010-08-12T13:57:51.816-06:00SilverRain, your insistence that you get to beat u...SilverRain, your insistence that you get to beat up the gay kid in the corner, and if anyone complains about it they're persecuting you is really not persuasive. Keep it up though, your complete dearth of reasons for those punches you keep throwing is quite telling.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09919483054658632621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-1967370830516757262010-08-12T11:19:25.679-06:002010-08-12T11:19:25.679-06:00Well, I was trying to give you the benefit of the ...Well, I was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt by saying you did not read it rather than saying you were other, less generous things.<br /><br />There is no purpose in continuing our conversation until you try to apply yourself a little more to understanding.SilverRainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-29228034572707697782010-08-12T07:57:25.725-06:002010-08-12T07:57:25.725-06:00this is the most recent anonymous.
SIlverrain-- ...this is the most recent anonymous.<br /> SIlverrain-- nonsense. I've read everything you've written here, and elsewhere. And aside from wild speculations about what might happen in the future that cannot be grounded in legal fact, *all* you have by way of justification for your opposition is your hurt feelings. After here, once again, being called out for getting the facts wrong (and I&#Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-290577475608713302010-08-12T07:27:37.402-06:002010-08-12T07:27:37.402-06:00Anonymous—You are wrong. It is not mere hurt feeli...Anonymous—You are wrong. It is not mere hurt feelings. I've been dealing with denigrations about my religion since I can remember, and I can deal just fine with that. I doubt you've bothered to actually read what I've said.<br /><br />Chedner—Ditto on what you've said. It was much better phrased than I could do. Thank you again for a great discussion.<br /><br />I have the feelingSilverRainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-48738370108836424922010-08-11T21:57:46.411-06:002010-08-11T21:57:46.411-06:00I definitely understand where you're coming fr...I definitely understand where you're coming from, SR. I've sort of had to go into a closet of sorts concerning my religious beliefs because of some of my anti-religious friends.<br /><br />I disapprove of intolerance of religion as much as I disapprove of intolerance of homosexuality.<br /><br />The problem, as I see it, is that pro-gay marriage (or what-not) feel like certain religions chednerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14963974112297032614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-62727727715786668962010-08-11T21:31:44.993-06:002010-08-11T21:31:44.993-06:00What you have described, Silverrain, as happening ...What you have described, Silverrain, as happening to you "here and now" is that your feelings are hurt by some very sharp words, perhaps even some very unfair and sharp words, directed against your religious beliefs.<br /> It is beyond incredible that you would think those hurt feelings the equivalent of the practical legal obstacles faced by gay men and lesbians every day of our Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-91622226145740262762010-08-11T16:48:49.643-06:002010-08-11T16:48:49.643-06:00Wow,
This post is excellent. You get to the hear...Wow,<br /><br />This post is excellent. You get to the heart of the issues and manage to look past all the propaganda on either side. Very insightful.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-1727737718379527622010-08-11T07:44:36.057-06:002010-08-11T07:44:36.057-06:00Chedner—No, I've greatly appreciated your inpu...Chedner—No, I've greatly appreciated your input. Thank you. You do an excellent job of presenting another perspective without putting me down.<br /><br />I've thought much more about this yesterday evening, and I think I've rephrased my conundrum yet again.<br /><br />True: I can't expect governments to legislate according to a religious belief. Yet, I can expect them to legislateSilverRainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-37114076727110046012010-08-10T16:11:01.464-06:002010-08-10T16:11:01.464-06:00I guess I do have one more comment to make:
"...I guess I do have one more comment to make:<br /><br /><i>"If you stopped denigrating my beliefs, perhaps I would feel safe enough to discuss things from a less fearful platform."</i><br /><br />This is exactly what we homosexuals are saying save that it's not just our beliefs that are being defamed but our lives. It's not just our beliefs that are difficult to discuss "chednerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14963974112297032614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-56261116449394050612010-08-10T16:06:17.079-06:002010-08-10T16:06:17.079-06:00I hope you haven't found my comments to be dis...I hope you haven't found my comments to be disrespectful.<br /><br />Just to answer your question, and then I will respect your desire to be finished: The stance I've taken isn't merely based on morality but on what <i>is here and now</i> not just what I believe will happen in the afterlife. It's also based on <i>empirical data</i> instead of fears and prejudices.chednerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14963974112297032614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-80486316025375358882010-08-10T14:20:40.549-06:002010-08-10T14:20:40.549-06:00Chedner—I never said I didn't want my kids eve...Chedner—I never said I didn't want my kids even hearing that gay marriage is okay. I only want to teach them in the time that I want to teach it to them, when they are ready. If you knew me, you would know that my family has never been one to shy away from other beliefs. <br /><br />Also, my morals are already forbidden from being taught in schools. Why should yours be allowed to be taught SilverRainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-41744241265668970692010-08-10T13:30:36.259-06:002010-08-10T13:30:36.259-06:004. She cites her personal beliefs, unsupported by ...4. She cites her personal beliefs, unsupported by any sort of research, as reasons why it's better for a child to have a parent of each gender. I shouldn't have to point out why this is wrong. The evidence in court showed that it hasn't been shown that children of hetero parents do better than children of gay/lesbian parents. In fact, I recently read an article about children of Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-27108901889344875742010-08-10T13:29:16.830-06:002010-08-10T13:29:16.830-06:00Someone posted a link to this entry in another blo...Someone posted a link to this entry in another blog. I found it so ridiculous that I thought I should share my response with the original author:<br /><br />This little write up is so full of holes it's painful. Naturally everyone is entitled to their opinion, but the author is so naive and self-satisfied that I feel embarassed for her.<br /><br />1. What makes the author think that because Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-46519469874131515812010-08-10T13:07:13.532-06:002010-08-10T13:07:13.532-06:00I personally didn't mention love but focused o...I personally didn't mention love but focused on duty. The proof has shown and continues to show that gay relationships are comparable, duty-wise, to (barren) heterosexual relationships.<br /><br />School curriculum merely would teach that gays <i>exist</i> that families headed by gay couples <i>exist</i>, that two boys or two girls <i>do</i> start families together for the same reasons that chednerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14963974112297032614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-67086957671539328322010-08-10T07:29:13.580-06:002010-08-10T07:29:13.580-06:00Rob—to quote your quote, "If that institution...Rob—to quote your quote, "If that institution hasn’t been affected by the societal changes of the past 100 years, including the divorce rate of opposite-sex couples, then the marriage of homosexuals will have little impact on it."<br /><br />That's just it. I believe the "societal changes" already have seriously damaged "the institution of marriage", and this is SilverRainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-79167284850648948222010-08-10T07:28:59.955-06:002010-08-10T07:28:59.955-06:00(continued)
Taking religion up again, I also have...(continued)<br /><br />Taking religion up again, I also have a serious concern that this battle is about oppressing religious beliefs. Many of those who support SSM scoff at the notion that those to whom religion is important (I'll use the shorthand religionists for now) might feel that their base beliefs are threatened, but I feel it is a very real concern.<br /><br />It is not a wild jump SilverRainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-9952620628055126192010-08-10T07:28:43.802-06:002010-08-10T07:28:43.802-06:00Chedner, thank you for your further explanation of...Chedner, thank you for your further explanation of your perspective. I appreciate it greatly. It has helped me better define what I'm trying to say, so I'm going to try to simplify for you and djinn. And bear in mind that I'm for the moment leaving religion out of it completely.<br /><br />There are two definitions of marriage: Marriage is about love, and marriage is about duty.<br />SilverRainhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00580230961425635077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-244056455177162582010-08-10T06:54:59.281-06:002010-08-10T06:54:59.281-06:00First, I would like to say that "Middle Ameri...First, I would like to say that "Middle America" is not completely anti-SSM. There are few places more "Middle America" than Iowa, and Iowa is one of the few places where homosexual couples can marry legally. Do not make the mistake of thinking that individuals who do not live within driving distance of an ocean are somehow uneducated or ignorant. That is not the case. AndRobinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-65378742108036945702010-08-10T04:35:56.740-06:002010-08-10T04:35:56.740-06:00This blog might provide some insight into how some...This blog might provide some insight into how someone who is gay can "choose" whom to love. Not an easy road, but full of rewards.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-62914596071541975652010-08-10T00:21:41.946-06:002010-08-10T00:21:41.946-06:00In response to Michelle:
There is a blog by a stra...In response to Michelle:<br />There is a blog by a straight lawyer who makes the point possibly more succinct than I could. I urge you to read it at:<br /><br />http://spaninquis.wordpress.com/2010/08/08/prop-8-decision-was-proper/<br /><br />In his summing up, he says of Prop 8 being overturned:<br />"After reading this decision I’ve changed my mind, and agree that it would be much simpler Rob Northamptonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02594826068470560047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-48875610370431765072010-08-09T23:53:25.047-06:002010-08-09T23:53:25.047-06:00Michelle, your concern is not inevitable in the le...Michelle, your concern is not inevitable in the least bit.<br /><br />Churches opposed to homosexuality are able to operate exactly the same in countries that allow gay marriage.<br /><br />There may be social pressures to change (and such will come no matter the legal status of homosexual relationships); however, there will not be any legal ramifications to force churches to operate differently.chednerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14963974112297032614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3270245506969727628.post-72200383079276387962010-08-09T23:38:59.019-06:002010-08-09T23:38:59.019-06:00SilverRain, thanks for articulating your thoughts....SilverRain, thanks for articulating your thoughts. I am continually thinking about this issue and reassessing my position and thoughts. It is a complex issue to be sure and I appreciate hearing others' thoughts on it.<br /><br />FWIW, I just wanted to add one additional reason why I'm concerned about gay marriage (yeah, so I'm not tired of talking about it, I guess).<br /><br />There Michellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08215431222961203620noreply@blogger.com